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bad urls fixed using online forms
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<!DOCTYPE html><!-- THIS IS INFO FOR ONE CAVE-->
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<!-- Only put one cave in this file (it may have multiple entrances) -->
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<!-- If you edit this file, make sure it is uploaded (pushed) to the expoweb repository (cave folder) and that you have added one or more entrance files to the entrances folder-->
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<!DOCTYPE html>
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<!-- This file is generated using the form documented at /handbook/survey/caveentry.html -->
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<!-- Only put one cave in this file -->
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<!-- If you edit this file by hand, make sure you update the database by doing a full data import -->
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<html lang="en">
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<head>
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<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=UTF-8" />
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<title></title>
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<link rel="stylesheet" type="text/css" href="/css/main2.css" /></head>
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<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=UTF-8"/>
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</head>
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<body>
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<cave>
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<non_public>False</non_public>
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<caveslug>1623-288</caveslug>
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<official_name>Lila Lupinenhöhle</official_name><!-- Use ü for u+Umlaut and ö for o+umlaut eg Höhle for Hohle and Glück for Gluck-->
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<official_name>Lila Lupinenhöhle</official_name>
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<area>1623</area>
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<area></area>
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<kataster_code></kataster_code>
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<kataster_number>288</kataster_number>
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<unofficial_number>2015-mf-06</unofficial_number>
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<!-- Add one entrance stanza for each entrance-->
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<entrance>
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<entranceslug>1623-288</entranceslug> <!-- Internal ID to refer to each entrance instance in the entrance files (typically the same as that filename (e.g. 1623-161c). Matches the 'slug' field in the entrance file -->
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<letter></letter> <!--Leave blank for single-entrance cave. If there is more than one entrace then the letter needs to be given. Generally matches the entranceslug ID. -->
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<entranceslug>1623-288</entranceslug>
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<letter></letter>
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</entrance>
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<explorers><p>CUCC 2015</p></explorers> <!-- 'CUCC Expo' and year(s) of exploration. To distinguish from caves explored by foreign groups. Individual names can be given too if it was a small cave. -->
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<underground_description></underground_description><!-- Underground description. (description of approach and entrance goes in entrance file). For a small cave this will be the entire description. For larger caves it will be the front page of the description, or a short intro, containing links to other pages with the cave description in, or even nothing but a link. -->
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<explorers><p>CUCC 2015</p></explorers>
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<underground_description></underground_description>
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<equipment><p></p></equipment>
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<references><p></references></p><!-- References to documentation. Could be Journal articles or Logbook entries. Can be links if the docs are online. -->
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<survey><p></p></survey><!-- Drawn-up surveys. Scans of paper surveys or images/PDFs of electronic surveys. Should include HTML to display current plan and elevation, with links to larger versions (See section on URLs and files). Could list links to multiple years of survey, or even a separate survey page if it's complicated enough. -->
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<references><p></references>
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<survey><p></p></survey>
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<kataster_status></kataster_status>
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<underground_centre_line></underground_centre_line>
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<notes></notes><!-- Normally empty, but place for anything else that should be noted, such as info on cave maybe being a duplicate, or lost -->
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<notes></notes>
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<length></length>
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<depth></depth>
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<extent></extent>
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<survex_file>caves-1623/288/288.svx</survex_file> <!-- Name of top-level survey file for this cave. Relative to the 'loser' survex repository. So for most caves that's "caves/cavenum/cavnum.svx". (e.g. caves/204/204.svx -->
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<description_file></description_file><!-- Path of top-level description file for this cave, when a separate file is used. Otherwise blank. -->
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<url>1623/288/288.html</url><!-- (Required). Relative URL of this cave. i.e the URL this cave appears at on the website, not including 'https://expo.survex.com/. Normally area/cavenum.html, e.g ('1623/165.html')-->
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<survex_file>caves-1623/2015-mf-06/2015-mf-06.svx</survex_file>
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<description_file></description_file>
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<url>1623/288/288.html</url>
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</cave>
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</body>
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</html>
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@ -35,8 +35,8 @@
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<underground_description><ul><li><a href="entrance.htm">Entrance Series</a></li><li><a href="70sroute.htm">1970's Route</a></li><li><a href="keg.htm">Keg Series</a></li><li><a href="brave.htm">Brave New World</a></li></ul></underground_description>
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<equipment></equipment>
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<references>The exploration is written up in many places:</p><ul><li><a href="../../years/1977/report.htm#youth">Cambridge Underground 1978</a></li><li><a href="../../years/1977/771649.htm">Belfry Bulletin 354</a>, Nick Thorne</li><li><a href="../../years/1978/report.htm#ropes">Cambridge Underground 1979</a></li><li><a href="../../years/1978/bcracc.htm">BCRA Caves & Caving 2</a>, Andy Waddington </li><li><a href="../../years/1978/npc79.htm">Northern Pennine Club Journal vol 3 no. 2, 1979</a>, Andy Waddington, Simon Farrow</li><li><a href="../../years/1978/descnt.htm">Descent 40 (Jan/Feb 1979)</a>, Nick Thorne</li><li><a href="../../years/1978/782034.htm">Belfry Bulletin 366 (Oct 1978)</a>, Nick Thorne</li><li><a href="../../years/1979/report.htm">Cambridge Underground 1980</a></li><li><a href="../../years/1979/descnt.htm">Descent 44</a>, Nick Thorne</li><li><a href="../../years/1979/792026.htm">Belfry Bulletin 378</a>, Nick Thorne</li><li><a href="../../years/1979/bcracc.htm">BCRA Caves & Caving 8</a>, Andy Waddington</li><li><a href="../../years/1977/andylg.htm#id1977-76-1">Logbook accounts</a></li><li><a href="histry.htm">Trip index</a></li><li><a href="../../years/1979/811412.htm">Speleo Krakow 1/2 Dec 1980</a>, Andy Waddington</li></ul><p>This last item, the only complete write up of 1977-79, appeared in Polish translation, and is published in the English original for the first time here.</references>
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<survey><p>The lower parts of the 1970s surveys are based on measurement of rope lengths and thus probably best categorised as Grade 2. The 2004 resurveyed depth for the taproom agrees closely with the 1970s surveys: <ul><li> <a href="../../years/1977/106.png">After first year of exploration (1977)</a></li><li> <a href="../../years/1978/106.png">After 1978 exploration</a></li><li> After 1979, the end of the original 1970's exploration: <a href="76upper.png">Upper half</a> and <a href="76lower.png">Lower half</a></li><li> <a href="76_final_col_small.png">2004 new exploration and resurvey down to the taproom</a></li><li> <a href="76_A2_2005.png">2005 exploration and resurvey down to spent ledge</a>
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[<a href="/expofiles/surveys/76/72_A2_2005.png">More detailed 3,182kB image</a>]</ul></p></survey>
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<survey><p>The lower parts of the 1970s surveys are based on measurement of rope lengths and thus probably best categorised as Grade 2. The 2004 resurveyed depth for the taproom agrees closely with the 1970s surveys: <ul><li> <a href="../../years/1977/106.png">After first year of exploration (1977)</a></li><li> <a href="../../years/1978/106.png">After 1978 exploration</a></li><li> After 1979, the end of the original 1970's exploration: <a href="76upper.png">Upper half</a> and <a href="76lower.png">Lower half</a></li><li> <a href="76_final_col_small.png">2004 new exploration and resurvey down to the taproom</a></li><li> <a href="76_A2_2005.jpg">2005 exploration and resurvey down to spent ledge</a>
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[<a href="/expofiles/surveys/76/76_A2_2005.png">More detailed 3,182kB image</a>]</ul></p></survey>
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<kataster_status></kataster_status>
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<underground_centre_line>Data for the sections covered so far by the resurvey project begun in 2004 can be downloaded as a <a href="76.3d">.3d file</a>.</underground_centre_line>
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<notes></notes>
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@ -26,8 +26,8 @@ chance to survey, on the derigging trip of a cave which is now "finished"),
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it is better to record all the passage, rather than part of it to a very high
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standard. Particularly to be avoided is a survey that doesn't connect to the
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rest of the cave.</p>
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<p>You are collecting data to fulfill a number of needs: the actual position
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<p><img class="onleft" width=70% src ="../i/76-clipart.png" />
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You are collecting data to fulfill a number of needs: the actual position
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of the passage for finding where it goes and possible connections; the shape
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of it for drawing pretty surveys; the location of possible leads for future
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exploration; geological info for working out how it got there.</p>
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@ -13,7 +13,7 @@ Janet & John document their cave</p>
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<p style="text-align: center; font-size: 120%; font-style: italic">Mostly by Wookey and Andy Waddington (1999)</p>
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<h3>Introduction</h3>
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<img class="onright" src ="../t/76-clipart.jpg" />
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<p>This part of the Expedition Handbook is about documentation - recording what
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the expedition found for posterity and so future expeditions have something to
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build upon. Mostly this means producing a good <b>survey</b> of each cave, but
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@ -59,7 +59,14 @@ Documentation is the key to keeping troggle in a state where someone can pick it
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<p>
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New functionality: e.g. making the whole thing GIS-centric is a possibility.
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A GIS db could make a lot of sense. Not in scope for this discussion.
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<p>There is not yet a front-end (javascript) framework on the client, i.e. a phone app or webpage, which is stable enough for us to commit effort to. Bits of troggle use very old jQuery ("edit this page", and the svx file editor) , and Flask looks interesting, but maybe in 2025 we could see a good way to move all the user interface to the client and just have an API on the server.
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<p>There is not yet a front-end (javascript) framework on the client, i.e. a phone app or webpage, which is stable enough for us to commit
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effort to. Bits of troggle use very old jQuery ("edit this page", and the svx file editor) , and Flask looks interesting
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(but <a href="https://adamj.eu/tech/2019/04/03/django-versus-flask-with-single-file-applications/">maybe is only simpler when
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starting a new project and doesn't scale to complexity</a> the way Django does, but maybe in 2025 we
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could see a good way to move all the user interface (rewritten to be GIS-centric) to the client
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(re-written in <a href="https://www.educba.com/typescript-vs-dart/">Typescript
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or Dart</a>) and just have an API on the server. [We already have a proof of principle JSON export API working at
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<a href="http://expo.survex.com/api/expeditions_json">expo.survex.com/api/expeditions_json</a>.]
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<h3>API</h3>
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<p>We will also need an API now-ish, whatever we do, so that keen kids can write their own special-purpose front-ends using new cool toys. Which will keep them out of our hair. We can do this easily with Django templates that generate JSON, which is <a href="https://www.cuyc.org.uk/committee/events_json_short/">what CUYC do</a>
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@ -69,8 +76,7 @@ A GIS db could make a lot of sense. Not in scope for this discussion.
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<p>
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So a useful goal, I think, is to make 'troggle2' accessible to a generic python programmer with no specialist skills in any databases or frameworks. Put against that is the argument that that might double the volume of code to be maintained, which would be worse. Nevertheless, an aim to keep in mind.
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But even 'just Python' is not that easy. Python is a much bigger language now than it used to be, with some esoteric corners. (Some of which could be very useful, such as the self-testing unit test
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capability: <a href="https://docs.python.org/3.8/library/doctest.html">docs.python.org/3.8/library/doctest</a> )
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But even 'just Python' is not that easy. Python is a much bigger language now than it used to be, with some esoteric corners.
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@ -15,8 +15,11 @@ Day to day cave recording and surveying tasks are documented
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in the expo "survey handbook"
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<h3>stroggle</h3>
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<p>At one time Martin Green attempted to reimplement troggle as "stroggle" using <a href="https://www.fullstackpython.com/flask.html">flask</a> instead of Django at
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<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gitorious">git@gitorious.org:stroggle/stroggle.git</a> (but gitorious has been deleted).</p>
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<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gitorious">git@gitorious.org:stroggle/stroggle.git</a> (but gitorious has been deleted).
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</p>
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<p>A copy of this project is archived by Wookey on <a href="http://wookware.org/software/cavearchive/stroggle/">wookware.org/software/cavearchive/stroggle/</a>.
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<p>(but <a href="https://adamj.eu/tech/2019/04/03/django-versus-flask-with-single-file-applications/">maybe is only simpler when
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starting a new project and doesn't scale to complexity</a> the way Django does?)
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<p>There is also a copy of stroggle on the backed-up, read-only copy of gitorious on "<a href="https://gitorious.org/">gitorious valhalla</a>"<br />
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<a href="https://gitorious.org/stroggle/stroggle.git/">stroggle code</a></br>
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<a href="https://gitorious.org/stroggle/stroggle-gitorious-wiki.git/">stroggle-gitorious-wiki</a></br>
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@ -68,12 +71,12 @@ But it has to be said that the
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<a href="https://docs.djangoproject.com/en/2.1/ref/templates/builtins/#std:templatefilter-dictsort">django
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HTML templating mechanism</a> is sufficiently powerful that it does almost
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amount to an additional language to learn.
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<p>Troggle has 66 different url recognisersand there are 71 HTML django
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<p>Troggle has 66 different url recognisers and there are 71 HTML django
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template files which the recognisers direct to.
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Not all page templates are currently used but still some kind of templating system would seem to be
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probably necessary.</p>
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probably necessary for sanity and maintenance self-documentation.</p>
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<p>The django system is sufficiently well-thought-of
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that it forms the basis for the framework-independent templaing engine
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that it forms the basis for the framework-independent templating engine
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<a href="https://jinja.palletsprojects.com/en/2.11.x/">Jinja</a> - and that site has a good discussion
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on whether templating is a good thing or not. There are about
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<a href="https://wiki.python.org/moin/Templating">20 different python template engines</a>.]
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@ -121,9 +124,13 @@ exist
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[This vastly underestimates the number of things that troggle does for us.
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See "<a href="/expofiles/documents/troggle/troggle2020.pdf" download>
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Troggle: a revised system for cave data management</a>"</em>.] And a VM is not required to run and debug troggle.
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Sam has produced a docker variant which he uses extensively.
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Sam has produced a docker variant which he uses extensively and I run it directly on local
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<a href="https://ubuntu.com/wsl">WSL/Ubuntu</a> in Windows10.
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<p>Troggle today has 6,400 non-comment lines of python and 2,500 non-comment lines of django HTML template code. Plus there is the integration with the in-browser HTML editor in JavaScript. Half of the python is in the parsers which will not change whatever we do. Django itself is much, much bigger and includes all the security middleware necessary in the web today.
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<p>But maintaining the code with the regular Django updates is <a href="trogdjango.html">a heavy job</a>.]
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<p>But maintaining the code with the regular Django updates is <a href="trogdjango.html">a heavy job</a>.
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<p><em>"the horrifying url rewrites that correspond to no files"</em> were bugs introduced by people who edited troggle without knowing what they were doing. We now have a test suite and these have all been fixed.
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<p>Troggle is now packaged such that it can run entirely on a standalone laptop and re-loads from scratch in 2 minutes, not 5 hours. So if one has a microSD card with 40GB of historical scanned images and photos, it will run on any Windows or Linux laptop. Even at top camp.
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]
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</div>
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How much work would this actually take:
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<ul>
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@ -8,7 +8,13 @@ Surface Survey - Stellerweg area
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<body>
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<div class="centre"><img src="../images/ssvypl.jpg" width="486" height="487" alt="" /></div>
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<p>Pete Lancaster surface surveying on the SE slopes of the Vorderer
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Schwarzmooskogel, above the Stellerweghöhle system.</p>
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Schwarzmooskogel in 1983, above the Stellerweghöhle system.</p>
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<p>This was the first attempt to find surface entrances corresponding to the large phreatic level
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of the 'Dartford Tunnel' area in 115, and specifically to find the surface location of the very
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string outward draft at the end of the Fuitility Series (Nutzlos) found by Chas and Phil Sargent.
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Phil had another look for these hoped-for entrances in 2018 and 2019, and learned that GPS altitudes are too poor
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to be useful. We need to do more surface suyveying like this!
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<p class="caption">Photo © Chas. Butcher, 1983. lookfutile.svx</p>
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<!-- Photo 195, Photo-CD 6121 1651 2353 img 35 -->
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