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cave text fix and added location to 2009 logbook entries

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Philip Sargent 2021-04-13 22:47:12 +01:00
parent 9252c883d4
commit 71c86b7b98
3 changed files with 61 additions and 20 deletions
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47
cave_data/1623-114.html
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@ -15,7 +15,7 @@
<area>5</area>
<kataster_code>0 + ?</kataster_code>
<kataster_number>114</kataster_number>
<unofficial_number>cucc-ps01-2018</unofficial_number>
<unofficial_number>2018-ps-01</unofficial_number>
<entrance>
<entranceslug>1623-114</entranceslug>
@ -41,13 +41,54 @@ Explored properly by Radost & Philip in 2019. <a href="/years/2019/logbook.html#
<br>Photos taken from turn-off point [from Stoger Weg]: "a barely discernable trod" to cave.
This "trod" is much more overgrown than it was in 1982.
<br>
I have just (May 1990) found an old note book which says this was explored by John, Tony and Andy C, but gives no detail on where or what. There is a strong suspicion that the cave was one of the "promising leads" found on their trip to Wildenseealm. However, the only published account refers the reader to the 1980 log book. This latter is, unfortunately, missing.</p><p>This does not appear to be in the Austrians' Kataster</notes>
I have just (May 1990) found an old note book which says this was explored by John, Tony and Andy C, but gives no detail on where or what.
There is a strong suspicion that the cave was one of the "promising leads" found on their trip to Wildenseealm. However, the only
published account refers the reader to the 1980 log book. This latter is, unfortunately, missing.</p>
<p>This does not appear to be in the Austrians' Kataster.
<p>
AERW email 30 June 2020:
The name Verlorenschacht was probably invented by me, and in the absence
of the 1980 logbook, there is no real reason to believe it was a schacht,
just something they thought worth a number in a year when we were making
the effort to actually number stuff we found. It is _probably_ not (as you
might hope) somewhere between 113 and 115, but it _might_ be ... There is
something in that area that one steps over on a particular (probably
obscure) route from one cave to another. I don't *think* it got a
number but it *might* be 114. If that surmise is anywhere near, then it
is between the Stogerweg and 113, rather than close to 115.
<p>
> But it is definitely not a "Schacht": more a horizontal scramble with a
> couple of pits. [Philip]
That doesn't sound like the thing in the 113 area I'm thinking of - that
was at least a bit of a climb down at the entrance (enough not to venture
in without at least a handline). Of course, if it was something on the
Wildenseealm walk, then it is nowhere near 113/41/115.
<p>
The missing 1980 logbook really is critical to this one.
<p>
Philip Sargent email 1 July 2020 to Wookey:
<p>
> According to AERW it might or might not be the same cave, or be might
> be remembering something else; but it is arguably in the right place
> as at least two groups have found it while looking for 115 coming from
> the path - and 113 is on the other (upper) side of the path - so it is
> topologically between 113 and 115 even if not geometrically between 113 and 115.
>
> I say let's go for it and rub out the uncertainty.
> Which means I had better write up a sketch survey for all 15m of it.
<p>
I've not followed the whole thread/saga, but at this stage I think this sounds reasonable. Almost anything would be an improvment and so long as we're reasonably sure that the original 114 is not marked as such in a way that might one day be noticed (and it seems unlikely that the 1980 logbook will surface at this point) any reasonable effort to get a cave in about the right place should suffice.
<p>
Wookey
</notes>
<length>25</length>
<depth>5</depth>
<extent>20</extent>
<survex_file></survex_file>
<description_file></description_file>
<url>1623/114.htm</url>
<url>1623/114</url>
</cave>
</body>
</html>

2
entrance_data/1623-2018-ad-01.html
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@ -16,7 +16,7 @@
<location_description></location_description>
<approach>Via 2012-dd-10</approach>
<underground_description></underground_description>
<photo><img src="2018-ad-01/2018-ad-01_entrance.JPG" width="600px"/></photo>
<photo><img src="/1623/2018-ad-01/2018-ad-01_entrance.jpg" /></photo>
<!-- marking options: P = Paint,
P? = Paint (?),
T = Tag,

32
years/2009/2009logbook.txt
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@ -135,14 +135,14 @@ After not getting woken up with a mug of tea in bed, Julian disobyed orders and
T/U 8hrs
===2009-07-26|161| Mike Richardson, Noel Snape, Holly Bradley, <u>Steve Jones</u>===
===2009-07-26|161 - bolts| Mike Richardson, Noel Snape, Holly Bradley, <u>Steve Jones</u>===
Took a while finding G. Took longer finding way on...
So M+H headed to D whilst N+S headed to the pitch just below the entrance. Put bolts in - then realised hangers were at Top Camp.
Stomped aorund on surface for a bitm fund M+H
Cairned route from D to G - 30 mins, then headed back.
===2009-07-25|Tunnocks| Noel Snape, Holly Bradley, <u>Steve Jones</u>===
===2009-07-25|Tunnocks - rope| Noel Snape, Holly Bradley, <u>Steve Jones</u>===
Strolled up hill. Warm. ???Got caving hats??? Heard rumours of Tunnocks rope - took in 100m + re-rigged - this gets you easily to snow slope, need 20m of rope for bottom bit. More fettling then N+H huddled in bothy while S rigged Caramel Catharsis. Home for tea and medals.
@ -238,7 +238,7 @@ We finally inspected the hole in the floor of Sombrero Passage that we normally
T/U 8 hrs
===2009-07-28|Tunnocks Surface Features| Frank Tully, <u>Martin Jahnke</u>===
===2009-07-28|Tunnocks - Surface Features| Frank Tully, <u>Martin Jahnke</u>===
Comedy of Errors appears to be above the level on the Tunnock's entrance shaft, giving continued ??? to the hope that we will be able to find a new entrance to the cave. I got location data for the different avens in Stone Monkey relative to the entrance from survex and we tried to locate surface features with the help of a GPS. It didn't work. Very frustrating.
@ -300,7 +300,7 @@ T/U 10hrs
[rigging diagram]
=== 2009-08-02 | Going Nowhere fast - Tunnocks | Becka, Steve, <u>Julian</u> ===
=== 2009-08-02 | Tunnocks - Going Nowhere fast | Becka, Steve, <u>Julian</u> ===
After many days of fruitless hacking on troggle, then losing my mp3 player sometime in the process of canoeing across Toplitzsee, and returning to hoards of very beery Austrians moving in on Base Camp like leiderhausen-clad apes with camper vans, I was seriously pissed off enough to go caving.
@ -368,13 +368,13 @@ I would like to put on record that I would like a proper canyonning holiday next
<em>T/U 18 hrs, (Mike TA 3hrs)</em>
===2009-08-04|204 Derigging|Kathryn Hopkins, <u>Emma Wilson</u>===
===2009-08-04|204 - Derigging|Kathryn Hopkins, <u>Emma Wilson</u>===
Derigged entrance pitches. Was reasonably wet.
T/U 1hr if that
===2009-08-03|204 On the Prowl, Catwalk|Kathryn Hopkins, Jess Stirrups, Ian Walker, Edvin Deadman, <u>Emma Wilson</u>===
===2009-08-03|204 - On the Prowl, Catwalk|Kathryn Hopkins, Jess Stirrups, Ian Walker, Edvin Deadman, <u>Emma Wilson</u>===
Went back with another rope to attempt to get to the bottom of the pitch we had run out of rope on last time. Kathryn and Jess S went in ahead, Jess added extra bolt on traverse whilst KAthryn finished rigging pitch. Edvin, Ian and I followed down about an hour later, when we arrived most of the rigging was doen which was good :) Pitch called Fat Cat. Was narrow at top then opened out below first rebelay. Next rebelay was even more airy :S, this dropped to one of the floors of a multi-level floored chamber. Across pitch looked like there was some horizontal level going off but would probably need more rigging to be able to swing into this and enthusiasm failed us. Put in another rebelay from natural and walked down a rope to another floor of chamber, yet another rebelay led to another level with small slot down - B lead, would need more rope, so not explored.
@ -403,13 +403,13 @@ From there on, things moved quickly (due to the stench of Zeus wee). Edvin, Jess
So that's it: two men on a Zeus caving trip; new cave explored and surveyed; no big dramas; and an efficient and satisfying derig back to the entrance pitches. All in all: a fine trip in a fine cave. Well done Zeuses!
===2009-08-04|204 Derigging|Kathryn Hopkins, <u>Emma Wilson</u>===
===2009-08-04|204 - Derigging|Kathryn Hopkins, <u>Emma Wilson</u>===
Derigged entrance pitches. Was reasonably wet.
T/U 1hr if that
===2009-08-01|Tunnock's - Usual Suspects|Becka Lawson, Ollie Stevens, <u>Steve Jones</u>===
===2009-08-01|Tunnocks - Usual Suspects|Becka Lawson, Ollie Stevens, <u>Steve Jones</u>===
S+B headed straight down. Surveyed several loops in complex phreas between chamber + main big passage; meanwhile Ollie "tame dangle-fairy" gave the pitch a few sling rebelays and new bolts.
@ -432,33 +432,33 @@ Meet Wook at pitchhead. With my bothy which I had left at the entrance. Grrr. P;
T/U 17-18hrs, Mike 3hrs (see also Julian's write up)
===2009-08-02|Tunnock's - Just for a Laugh|Martin Green, <u>Steve Jones</u>===
===2009-08-02|Tunnocks - Just for a Laugh|Martin Green, <u>Steve Jones</u>===
===2009-08-03|Tunnock's - Stomach ULSA|Noel Snape, <u>Mike Richardson</u>===
===2009-08-03|Tunnocks - Stomach ULSA|Noel Snape, <u>Mike Richardson</u>===
Down Tunnocks to continue Holly and Noel's push down the Stomach. Took down 60m of rope plus drill, arrived at final bolt from previous trip, added y-hand (1 bolt each) and dropped the pitch - some to-inf and fro-ing to get the wider parts of the rift. At the bottom of pitch used natural to descend three c2s (bottom two are free climbable). Rift continues for a few metres until floor drops away again and will need rigging to carry on. Grade A lead.
===2009-08-03|Tunnock's - Alphabet Soup|Wookey, Andrew Atkinson, <u>Becka Lawson</u>===
===2009-08-03|Tunnocks - Alphabet Soup|Wookey, Andrew Atkinson, <u>Becka Lawson</u>===
Surprising degree of enthusiasm for caving today given that almost everybody stayed up until dawn on the rescue (thanks guys...). I fancied something mellow so we headed off to cross off easy QMs in Tunnocks and improved the survey (took the full print out with us and scrawled on it). Sorted out a mess in Germknodel and surveyed 50m each in QM30C and in QM37B
(34B is a pitch). Return to Usual Suspects to remove the final bits from the rescue and I dragged the srtetcher out as my penance. Saw Andrew's disto-x/PDA combination in action underground for the first time - impressive though probably no faster than trad surveying.
T/U 6 hrs
===2009-08-04|Tunnock's - Goody Goody|Holly Bradley, Andrew Atkinson, <u>Becka Lawson</u>===
===2009-08-04|Tunnocks - Goody Goody|Holly Bradley, Andrew Atkinson, <u>Becka Lawson</u>===
Dragged in a drill and rope to check out more QMs. Checked on the Usual Suspects water level - siilarly damp (still raining). Started with a QMB nearly opposite Naughty Naughty in Dubious Pleasure and hit the jackpot - it startedas a crawly/stoopy passage and gradually got larger and even had crusty stal formations. Traversed over a blind pit and then a larger drippy pitch on the right. At the next pitch the ledge looked too teetery so Andrew put in a traverse line on naturals (needs 20-25m). Then hit an even bigger pitch which Holly and I excitedly lobbed a couple of big rocks down before Andrew screamed stop at us. Spoil sport. "There's a rope". Oops. We'd managed to come to the eyeholes visible level with the main hang ledge in Usual Suspects. Got around to the second eyehole and then hit a short but monster section of phreas - maybe 15m wide with a howling gale coming out. We teetered up a vast pile of rocks semi-stuck together to end up overlooking a giant pitch. Unfortunately in the wet conditions we couldnt' see down as it was filled with a fine mist and the disto-x struggled too. Surveyed 350m - a fine trip. The end section seemed to have way too much cave and too little rock holding it all up.
T/U 9 hrs
===2009-08-05|Tunnock's - Frankly Freezing|Andrew Atkinson, <u>Becka Lawson</u>===
===2009-08-05|Tunnocks - Frankly Freezing|Andrew Atkinson, <u>Becka Lawson</u>===
Expo dinner day so it had to be a shorty (though we got an 8:30am underground start). After hinting heavily all morning, I managed to persuade Andrew to derig Usual Suspects since we'd lad 4 hours of dry for the first time in forever. He got wet but the rocks we'd lobbed down yesterday had missed the rope. Then did a short survey in Frankly Freezing before it all got a bit chilly. I slogged out with 150m in Big Bertha whilst Andrew skipped along with more rope and the metalware.
T/U 5 hrs
===2009-08-06|Disaster boys in the canyon of doom|Noel Snape, Steve Jones, <u>Julian Todd</u>===
===2009-08-06|Canyoning - Disaster boys in the canyon of doom|Noel Snape, Steve Jones, <u>Julian Todd</u>===
Noel most keen on canyoning. Steve came too and got the best wetsuit leaving me with the 7 piece homemade. Gave lifts to Martin and Holly and 2 bikes to return via Ischl - Bla Alm canyon (Holly went up Loser too).
@ -512,7 +512,7 @@ T/U 10hrs
[rigging diagram]
===2009-08-09|Tunnocks Derig|Frank Tully, <u>Ian Walker</u>===
===2009-08-09|Tunnocks - Derig|Frank Tully, <u>Ian Walker</u>===
A trip into Stone Monkey to recover the 30m rope at the far end and to derig out from there. My first visit :- a very interesting place, glad I took the chance to see it! Packed all the derigged gear into the tacklebags, except the entrance pitch (92m) which we paellaed out in one go.
@ -569,7 +569,7 @@ A great finale to a great expo :)
T/U 11hrs (Wook 13hrs).
===2009-08-04|Damp Squib|Steve Jones, <u>Martin Green</u>===
===2009-08-04|Tunnocks - Damp Squib|Steve Jones, <u>Martin Green</u>===
We descended Tunnocks with a Makita drill with the aim of picking up some rope from the start of Stone Monkey. Not knowing the location og the new entrance to Stone Monkey I went around a long loop for 20 minutes to find Steve having already found the bag. We continued onto Just For a Laugh to look at pitches. The first near station justforalaugh.12 looked a little wet and appeared to have audible connection to the pitch near justforalaught2.1 which was considerably drier. I rigged this pitch with a natural thread in the floor as backup, and a y-hang across the rift. Additional passage may be reachable over the top of this pitch ot from a rift a metre of two down. At the bottom a narrow rift to a pitch went off as well as a small window to a parallel clean washed shaft, with a small stream coming in. I tried to rig out og this water with a wide y-hang and a rebelay out from the water. But this was in rain due to an aven further alonf the shaft making it drippy. I descended going down several ledges, that the original stream goes down. At the bottom a rift went off, which quickly becomes too tight, along with some small phreatic passage which also closed down. I retreated now slightly damp to survey out with Steve derigging, taking all the gear back to the bivy (all new bolts were greased).